Curse

primitiveworker · Sep 02, 2005, 06:11 PM // 18:11

Ok, I've been involved in a rather depressing thread over at GWO (see it here ) and I would like to instigate some action.

I myself am a Smite Team player. A lot of people hate smite. Now, since I'm more interested in the health of the metagame than I am in winning in its current state, I would like to ask the GW Tombs-playing Community to start sharing and collaborating on strong builds which can stand up to smite.

Let's not have a silly vocal minority nerf this game into oblivion every time a dominant flavor of the month build comes out. Let's show them that all you have to do is adapt to the metagame, and thereby shift it in a new direction.

Thanks.

Nash · Sep 02, 2005, 06:15 PM // 18:15

Ether Renewal is overpowered. Flavor of the Month is for noobs with no clue, but disregarding real balance issues as Flavor of the Month is a mistake.

primitiveworker · Sep 02, 2005, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nash

Ether Renewal is overpowered. Flavor of the Month is for noobs with no clue, but disregarding real balance issues as Flavor of the Month is a mistake.

So, rather than disrupt the ability of the Ether Renewal user to spam spells and keep enchantments (each of which are easy, and widely applicable) you'd ask ANet to change the skill too?

Spura · Sep 02, 2005, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

you'd ask ANet to change the skill too?

Pretty much.

Nexx · Sep 02, 2005, 07:01 PM // 19:01

I love my zealot fire on my warrior and like to spam tactics skills... but errr.. shatter enchantment owns me so I'm not entirely convince that Zealot fire is m4d pwnage.

smurfhunter · Sep 02, 2005, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nash

Ether Renewal is overpowered. Flavor of the Month is for noobs with no clue, but disregarding real balance issues as Flavor of the Month is a mistake.

lol. ether renewal is overpowered, and will be nerfed. but fotm is not for noobs, plenty of guilds got their reputation from running spirit spam just last week. the trick is to have a 'modified' fotm, and most completely original builds dont work.

if i may ask you, what builds do you play in tombs right now?

primitiveworker · Sep 02, 2005, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Let's try to stay on topic: Tombs team builds which can disable a Smite team. Consider the common counters to Smite, and try to not be vulnerable in the same way.

smurfhunter · Sep 02, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

Let's try to stay on topic: Tombs team builds which can disable a Smite team. Consider the common counters to Smite, and try to not be vulnerable in the same way.

ok sorry i get diverted alot. anyway i see the problem with smite teams is they are beaten by better smite teams... i was once in one of those 'modified' fotms that won hall a few times, they were running 3 monks, but only 1 emo/warrior pair. the othe rwas a pretty standard n/r. and instead of the pair there was a mesmer and a fire ele (also emo to confuse people).

the trick was the meteor shower + other aoes ( i was the nooby smiter so im not sure what s/he did exactly

) coupled with the smites was more effective at aoe damage, while someone (i forget who.. some ele secondary) was trying to snare them into the huge aoe (smite + fire) with ward against foes.

basically this was a pretty good build to run, only we totally owned the hall because the smite aoe coupled with meteor shower + fire storm on the altar was total pwnage.

just like the spirit spam.. they were beaten ony by better spammers. BUT its only been around for like a week now and im not the most experienced player out there, so lets hope theres a non smite that can pull it off

Zeru · Sep 02, 2005, 08:36 PM // 20:36

I made up a spot outline which should prove decent in another thread.

3 monks. 2 heal 1 prot 2 seeds is needed as well as aegis/guardian/shielding hands.
2 Mesmer/Necros. Diversion Symp visage, enfeebling blood/shadow of fear, mantra inscriptions, energy drain, signet of humility, arcane echo/rend.
1 El/mo Warder/basic prot.
2 Hammers with JI

Mesmers shutdown the elmos, an enemy mesmer, or enemy monks depending on team setup. Half attention of a mesmer on a monk, and two hammers will make killing not too hard. The teams with only two monks will go down fast.

Warder is there to keep your team alive long enough for the elmos to be neutralized. Warrior hate is to prevent energy denial via fear me. Overuse sympathetic visage.

Sidenote: Smiting is not overpowered, ether renewal is. If you think Ether Renewal is fine you should end every post with a sig of "I have no clue what I'm talking about."

Second sidenote: Try airspike. Carry multiple copies of Rends, energy management (perhaps Ether Renewal

), and coordinate your spikes on the elmos first.

primitiveworker · Sep 02, 2005, 08:54 PM // 20:54

Signet of Humility, Diversion, Blackout and any number of Interruption and Enchantment Removal skills make Ether Renewal useless. Disabling the E/Mo smiter also turns off the smite bomb, so you've effectively removed two enemies from play.

Ether Renewal doesn't do anything at all if they have no enchantments or cannot spam spells. It may be powerful when it works, but turning it off is easy enough.

Is say this as a smiter who has been turned off effectively time and again. Once the E/Mo's are turned off they can be slaughtered.

I am inclined to agree that it may be a bit too powerful, because I can start the engine up immediately after being res'd with a signet at 25% energy. In the seconds it takes to cast Renewal, Boon, Reversal, Aura of Rest, Zealots, I'm at full operating capacity again.

But Well of the Profane and Nature's Renewal can be used to significantly diminish the ability for an E/Mo to spin back up to full operation from res. That's the only real unfair advantage I see: they become immediately effective upon res.

smurfhunter · Sep 02, 2005, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

Signet of Humility, Diversion, Blackout and any number of Interruption and Enchantment Removal skills make Ether Renewal useless. Disabling the E/Mo smiter also turns off the smite bomb, so you've effectively removed two enemies from play.

true but you cant *just* go for the emos, its not as if they arent protected and you cant completely ignore warriors either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

Ether Renewal doesn't do anything at all if they have no enchantments or cannot spam spells. It may be powerful when it works, but turning it off is easy enough.

if im in a jam like that all you need is like 18 energy; ether renewal, when you don you have like 10 energy so aura, then hit draw for some regen, put up zealots, and spam draw. i agree its not the funnest thing but the only time im in that kind of jam is when i get resd (usually)

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

Is say this as a smiter who has been turned off effectively time and again. Once the E/Mo's are turned off they can be slaughtered.

not entirely true... slaughtering emos doesnt take 10 seconds. and once again you cant exactly ignore tanks, they have res sig and can do a bit of damage on their own (something thats taken me a bit of time to learn really)

Quote:

Originally Posted by primitiveworker

I am inclined to agree that it may be a bit too powerful, because I can start the engine up immediately after being res'd with a signet at 25% energy. In the seconds it takes to cast Renewal, Boon, Reversal, Aura of Rest, Zealots, I'm at full operating capacity again.

But Well of the Profane and Nature's Renewal can be used to significantly diminish the ability for an E/Mo to spin back up to full operation from res. That's the only real unfair advantage I see: they become immediately effective upon res.

natures renewal wont do a thing - only works on maintained enchants ( with the -1 energy regen) smiters dont use those.

as to well of profane, its usually a war of corpses all over agan. the necros use traversa/consume to keep it under the lid, and if the enemy isnt useing corpses you make your own.

and actually if im resd at 20 energy i dont go straight back to fully operational - i need to cast zealots, renewal, aura, and *then* im back. this is easy at full energy and when theyre all recharged, but are a pain if you just used them before you died. so all in all those are counters people use, but they arent as effective as you make them seem. (you cant base a build on it)

primitiveworker · Sep 02, 2005, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Nature's Renewal still makes all enchantments take twice as long to cast, and so are twice as easily interrupted.

twicky_kid · Sep 03, 2005, 01:47 AM // 01:47

i do see ether renewal as a problem in balance. everyone is yelling just remove it its easy. WRONG. only 2 spells on the entire game can remove all enchantments in 1 shot and 1 will most likely kill you if you remove all the enchantments that the ele/mo uses. single enchant removal won't work. it is quickly covered up by reversal, guardian and breeze.

only way i see this being interrupted is a small team of mes all using shatter enchantment on the same target at once.

it will be changed soon. hopefully before this becomes a wild fire like natures did. at least natures took "some" skill to use. this build is totally newb friendly.

knives · Sep 03, 2005, 01:53 AM // 01:53

Well of Profane
Signet of Humility
Mantra of Inscriptions
Diversion

All of those shutdown an E/Mo smiter. Mass degen also kills smite teams. Conure phantasm + well of suffering + tainted + etc will work. If you dont want to delve into the death line because you are afraid of martyr monks, go curses and combo suffering + faintheartedness + conjure phantasm 3 + 2 + 5 = 10 degen. Not too hard to spam degen on everything. You could even put iron mist on them and the degen would still work.

Ensign · Sep 03, 2005, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Find the best tools to shut down opposing smiters. Then work those into your own team, add a couple of Emo smiters, and go wreck people.

People never listen.

Peace,
-CxE

Tevash Szat · Sep 03, 2005, 04:23 PM // 16:23

To make the e/mo worthless is either have a diversion spammer while they r spamming draw condition since they probably wont notice it, backfire which will hurt them alot, or have a ranger fire a distracting shot into the draw conditioning. Oh yea, seed does help alot against smiters.

Swifty · Sep 03, 2005, 04:43 PM // 16:43

quick casting + Backfire + Conjur phantasm + phantom pain=E/Mo death

GreatLich · Sep 03, 2005, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Find the best tools to shut down opposing smiters. Then work those into your own team, add a couple of Emo smiters, and go wreck people.

People never listen.

Peace,
-CxE

Isn't that kinda like... Fighting Zealot's Fire with Zealot's Fire? ;p

Warskull · Sep 03, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swifty

quick casting + Backfire + Conjur phantasm + phantom pain=E/Mo death

Ether renewal heals, in fact it usually outheals backfire.

magicplayer.exe · Sep 05, 2005, 02:41 PM // 14:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warskull

Ether renewal heals, in fact it usually outheals backfire.

then lets do this then

quick casting + Backfire + Soul Leech + Conjur phantasm + phantom pain=E/Mo death

or you could always use an enchament removel after the backfire